Dragon Communion Seal | Elden Ring Wiki

Some people say this seal makes frostbite(from Frozen Lightning Spear) scale with arcane, some say it does not bc frostbite never scales with arcane. Which one is true??

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Reading this page has made me even more confused on whether or not this seal increases status buildup of spells. When the game came out it did and it was a very noticeable amount. Did the status buildup increase from arcane only get reduced or removed completely?

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The actual soft cap for this seal is 30 Faith and 45 Arcane.

For Arcane scaling you will get 3 Incant Scaling points until 45 Arcane. Then only 1 point each level.

For faith scaling you will get 2.50 Incant Scaling points until 30. Then 1.2 point until 45 Faith. And after that 1 point every 2 or 3 levels.

So from 30 Faith to 45 Faith (15 Levels) you will get only 18 Incant Scaling points which it's wasteful, better to invest them into mind or vigor or anything else.

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"other Arcane scaling weapons the player migth use" noticed a spelling error, its in the 'notes & tips' section if anyone plans to fix it^^

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Article claims:
"This seal's scaling with Arcane also means it increases the Bloodloss, Scarlret Rot, Poison and Madness build up of incantations cast."

Ignoring the spelling error on Scarlet Rot are we certain Scarlet Rot build up is enhanced by Arcane? Because it contradicts the Info on the Arcane page, which only mentions blood, poison, madness and sleep for Arcane. Also all the Scarlet Rot incantations like the dragon ones and Scarlet Aeonia have fixed build up values on their respective wiki sites, which is unusual if the build up is supposed to be dependent on your Arcane level and not fixed at all.

I believe the error is on this page. Arcane doesnt influence Scarlet Rot build up on weapons like the Antspur Rapier (when given Arcane Scaling) or Arcane scaling Weapons buffed with Rot Grease. So why would it influence incantations only?

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I've defeated that banished knight 3 times now and not once has it dropped the dragon communion seal. Is my game bugged?

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I was struggling against the Valiant Gargiyles... Then I went to get this seal. And Smarags Glintstone breath. Suddenly incants felt powerful. That said, if I don't go arc/fth, and go fth or fth/dex when is it time to change seals, and what seal?

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Although it procs madness faster, that 40% damage buff that two Frenzy Flame seals give is actually way more valuable to pure madness casters. I’m talking like 1200 vs 800 damage.

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Kinda looks like the Rite of Kindling from DS1

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for anyone confused o n the math...

Faith Arcane
16 10
+58 = +58
74 10

Faith Arcane
16 10
+23 +35 = +58
39 45

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If you want to cast rotten breath as a lvl 1 wretch this is a good choice due to the zero carry weight as it will save precious pounds to allow you to still wear the silver tear helm with it

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Can somebody help me? I can't find it, I killed multiple times the enemy but he doesn't drop anything

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Arcane/Faith are best builds and this fits perfectly.

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Dragon Communion Incantations are influenced by casting speed, article is wrong. Noticeably so, even. The only exception is the jumping dragon casts.

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At lvl 115, 43 vig, 17 mind, 25 fth, 31 arc - dragon communion seal +6, Marika's scarseal. Plant latenna on the tree where a branch is coming out. My latenna is only +4. Now approach from the sanctum, use dragonmaw. When he aggros, pull off and latenna will aggro him, he'll keep trying to reach latenna and fail in most of his combos, take your time munching on him with dragonmaw. Even if he poise breaks just spam the maw on him. Took me like 5-7ish minutes.

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When I hold one of these in each hand, is the incantation additive or multiplicative? Meaning is it 15% + 15% = 30%, or 1.15*1.15 = 32.25%, bonus to the Dragon incants?

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It wrote:　＂ At 74 faith and above primarily faith scaling seals (Erdtree Seal and Godslayer's Seal) outperform this seal at the same level of stat investment (39/45 Fai/Arc for the Dragon Communion Seal)　＂

But 39+45=84, not 74

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second strongest seal

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Urgh, another Heroes Grave...what a hassle.

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I don't know why this Wiki says Radagon's Icon doesn't effect Dragon Communion spells but it absolutely does. It just doesn't effect the initial start up of the spell. It effects the second casting of it. While i wouldn't say it nearly as effective as id like the statement it doesn't work is still false.

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i've found it's useful just because of the fact that it weighs 0. i used it to apply bloodflame to a GUGS and, when combined with armor, i didn't have enough weight for a seal without fat rolling. went through, got this and giant hunt, now i'm easily one-shotting everything.

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"Will increase the buildup of Status Effects that spells cause, like madness for Frenzied Burst."

This is incorrect! I tested Bloodflame Talons, Swarm of Flies, Bloodflame Boon, and Rotten Breath today using my own PS5 and my roommates PS5. There is NO INCREASE for status buildup on these spells when you increase arcane, so just meeting the arcane requirement, investing in faith, and using a faith only scaling seal is most efficient.

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Is this worth using with only getting to 17 arcane for the dragon abilities? Or should I just use the regular one until I get to the capitol?

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Best early game caster tool, even better than Meteorite Staff. Catch Flame does stupid damage with this thing

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I briefly tested dual wielding these (NG+) against the Godrick Soldier patrolling the road behind the Church of Elleh, and it seems that the 15% damage boost to Dragon Communion Incantations DOES stack.
I'd urge others to test this to confirm it. If true, the same should apply to other seals/staves that boost a particular school of spells.

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This seal looks like my ass after I eat too much chili.

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In case anyone wants to know like I did, dragon communion at 45/45 his 336 incant scaling

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The dragon communion seal does have a softcap of sort at 30 faith, investment above that level will yield only a little more than 1 incant scaling per level, it's not worth it. If you go 45 fth 45 arc you might as well use the erdtree seal with 80 fth (same investment), it will be more powerful (unless you already have investments in arcane for the spell requirments, I guess). For the dragon communion seal you should stop at 30 fth 45 arc and invest your remaining points in vigor endurance mind. You can always use the faith talisman and the faith-boosting tear to get your faith to 45 temporarily for when you want just a little bit more damage.

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Has 0 weight and can be obtained without killing any enemy yourself (you can lure the knight holding it into the chariot). So you can, technically, finish the game at 0 weight and only ever using dragon incantations.

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"Brings character way above PvP meta levels" Who tf cares? This is a long ass, giant, open world game. This community is still acting like it's Dark Souls. People should be free to level up however much they want instead of feeling constrained to a made up meta. Especially when the PvP in this game sucks ass anyways.

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Does anyone else think that this seal looks an awful lot like a cursemark?

Similarly, the description references “formless drakeblood.” Was the Formless Mother a dragon?

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It kinda makes sense that this seal doesnt count Placidusax Ruin as a Dragon Communion incant, from a lore point perspective Dragonlord Placidusax never went out from the Heart of the Storm when the war broke out in Leyndell and judging from the way how Dragon Communion works, they seem to copy and imitate how lesser dragons, and even well known dragons attack so it is likely they no one ever saw him besides you and maybe a select few powerful beings.

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damn ppl really complaining about nerfs bc they can't crutch broken gear anymore. guess y'all gotta actually play the game dang so sad.

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Buffs Dragon Communion Incantations by 15%.
Thing I noticed with this is that you don't even have to be using this to get the benefit, just holding it. You can use a different catalyst for scaling reasons and still get the bonus. Makes me wonder if this applies to other catalysts and such

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This seal softcaps at 45/45, not 30/45. From 30 to 45 Fth the seal gains one spell buff each point, after that the spell buff drops significantly to less than 1 per point, just like Arcane.

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For a STR build with minimal FAI and ARC, using dragon incants.

Would it be better to use this seal, or the clawmark seal for the STR scaling?

I’ll test to find the answer.

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this seal existing is proof enough that you can beat elden ring at 0 equip load.

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At 45 arcane and 30 faith, urgent heal restores 171 hp. At the listed hp per incant scale of 1.15 on urgent heal's page, this means the incant scaling this seal grants from 30 faith is 171/1.15 = about 149.

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Can confirm status buildup for frenzied burst. Golden order seal requires 2 frenzied burst hit to trigger madness. Dragon seal only one. Tested on okina tarnished summon by spirit calling snail in spiritcallers cave. U guys can test other tarnished only status buildup weapons/spells/incant/ashofwar there

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Who edited the page? The actual softcaps are 45/45, not 30/45, just like any hybrid catalyst.

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For anyone wondering about this on a pure arcane build: at +10, with 80 arcane and 15 faith (15 being the minimum for basic dragon breath attacks) you get an incant of 314, and 319 if you go for 17 faith to use Dragonclaw as well.

I'm currently running 80 arcane and 31 faith, which gives me an incant scaling of 355.

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It doesn't drop from the Ulcerated Tree Spirit.

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Nerf to status buildup has actually made the blood incantations worthless. Oh Fromsoft and your scorched earth nerf policies, will you ever learn?

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After the patch does it still increase blood\poison build up with blood flame and poison armament?

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so, softcaps are 45 faith/45 arc?

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What does the arcane scale affect? I’m sure it affects status effects. But does it also affect the damage of incantations?

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At 60/50 Arc/Fth, I have 353 scaling. I also have 60 int, and Golden Order gets the same. Can't tell which is overall better yet, lol.

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At 60/50 Arc/Fth, I have 353 scaling. I also have 60 int, and Golden Order gets the same. Can't tell which is overall better yet, lol.

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With its insane spell buff of 384, it beats any seal and they don't even come close. It's so high in fact that you're better off using this if you want the most damage out of ANY type of incantation, even beastial or fundamentalist, the seals of which scale with 2 stats. Stone of Gurranq with this does REALLY good damage.

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Still strong damage wise but i can no longer find a difference between the status build up on this seal compared with any other. Shame.

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How bad was the nerf?

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they even nerfed the status buildup on this, lmao

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anyone got experience with the status effect buildup nerf from patch 1.04 on this guy? I love my seal and im sad cuz it sounds like rotten breath wont proc so easily now

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what stats good for a low lvl build with this seal?

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It honestly feels like madness increasing was an entirely unintended result given the fact that the madness seal scales with everything EXCEPT arcane. Either that or the balancing is seriously even worse than I thought

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Anyone has the incant scaling with 25 faith and 80 arcane with this being +10? Thanks!

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I'm offended that you have to associate yourself with stupid-ass dragons if you want your incantations to scale with arc. I'm here for the Tres, Duo, Unus, not for flying away and spewing magma like a little coward.

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Where did the 121 incant scaling come from? Mine has 60 at all upgrade levels.

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30FTH/45ARC is definitely the sweet spot for this seal.

- 15FTH/45ARC = 278 scaling
- 20FTH/45ARC = 291 scaling (+13 scaling)
- 25FTH/45ARC = 305 scaling (+14 scaling)
- 30FTH/45ARC = 318 scaling (+13 scaling)
- 35FTH/45ARC = 324 scaling (only +6 scaling per 5 points of faith)

On the other side of the spectrum, adding 5 ARC (for a total of 50) only receives 323.5 (rounded up to 324) scaling in a 30FTH/50ARC setup, which shows the same diminishing returns as faith in the 35FTH/45ARC example. TLDR: 30FTH/45ARC and go clap some cheeks.

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IDK how accurately spell buff determines damage, but this is the way to go for the highest spell buff: 384 at 80 ARC. Godslayer seal reaches 304 at 70 FTH so i assume it won't even get close.

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So I’ve seen that this increases the build up of madness, but does it also increases the build up of blood loss and poison with spells like swarm of flies and poison mist? I did a little testing on different enemies but I couldn’t really see a difference.

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I think I have a bug regarding skill use?
So I have an ash of war on a dagger (bloodhound's step) on left hand and on right hand I have dragon communion's seal and I get the "No skill" for my trigger. Swapping to other weapons displays the correct skill. If I swap right/left around, the step skill shows up just fine. Or am I doing something very wrong here? lol

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Man the area to get to this is frustrating

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Keep in mind because of the dual scaling the soft cap for arcane is 60 so going past that isn’t worth it. After 60 arcane leveling faith will increase your damage more despite having only B scaling.

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Gets hate mail calling me bad cause arcane crutch

Points to seal that literally scales with arcane

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Does this seal buff the dragon cult incantations, or just the ones gained through spending dragon hearts at the churches?

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for frenzy spells what is better: Dragon communion seal + frenzy flame seal or 2 frenzy flame seals ?

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If I’m mostly using dragon incantations but I’m Str/Faith instead of Faith/Arcane, is it better to use this or the Clawmark Seal?

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Faith scaling B and Arcane scaling S
This thing's scaling is BS

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this seal screams : "invest in faith to unlock utility spells, arcane is where it's at!"

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I'm genuinely confused at some of these comments. If you are going for Arcane/Faith builds then going down the route of bleeding is basically a must, so why are people wasting precious FP on terrible and pointless weapon buffs like Bloodflame blade when they could just level arcane up to 60 and Faith at 25 to cover the bases of the better Faith buffs and have a good stepping stone for applying bleed to weapons via black whetstone while also having the Arcane increase bleed on weapons like Rivers of blood and Elenora's Poleblade? Like....thats the main point of Arcane and the Faith damage equivalents are just absolutely pitiful and useless compared to the Arcane/Faith hybrid blood spells so I'm just genuinely confused why someone would level Faith so much when it provides so little past 25.....yall in these comments are just really bad at building builds lol. The spells are basically just a bonus to your melee build and some of you seem to think the Faith part of the Arcane/Faith builds is for some reason doing more damage and its just genuinely confusing as hell when that's not the main point of Faith spells just by looking at the fact a majority of Faith spells are buffs and removal of debuffs. Some of these comments really just go to show some of the people who comment have a blatant misunderstanding of the game at a fundamental level and it's just sad.

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323 incant scaling with 50 arcane / 30 faith, you don't need to pump faith too high for this

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Not bugged. If weapon buffs and heals scaled with the arcane what would be the point in making a faith build over arcane?

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i dont know why they didnt make faith and arcane separate things. it's almost impossible to build a viable arcane/faith build without overleveling like mf...

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30 faith 45 arcane gives a fully upgraded seal 318 scaling, and going to 45 faith gives only 18 scaling. For a purely dragon communion build, I would stop there and invest into 60 vigor and mind before going back to faith.

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+9 Inc scaling is 240

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I killed the enemy and didn't get the seal...

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3 videos covering builds utilizing this seal.
Zero videos covering how to obtain said seal without tearing your hair out >_>

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Is it possible to use 2 of these and get the buff from both?

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332 incant scaling + 10 with 32 FTH (enough for wog) and 56 arcane (occult infusion softcap). Top tier for offensive incants, whilst only faith is considered for healing and weapon buffs.

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Is it worth putting points into Arcane just to make use of this seal’s scaling status buildup?

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Is it not just 1 stonesword key needed to get access into the area? I just went here again a few days ago on second playthrough and pretty sure it was only one needed. The imp statue is to the left of the fog. I don't remember using two on my first playthrough either- or any fog doors needed two.

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Unironically the best seal for damage incantations

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Its weight of 0 makes this seal great for non-casters with baseline faith/arcane, since with the stat boost from Godrick's Great Rune you have access to Heal, Bestial Vitality and Flame Cleanse Me without spending a single level.

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at +10, 99 arcane and 99 faith, the incant scaling is 415. This does not increase with Faithful Canvas Talisman.
at +10, 50 arcane and 50 faith, the incant scaling is about 340.

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at +10, 80 arcane, 12 faith, this seal has an incant scaling of *312*

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Here are my tests, using BLACK FLAME on the giant.
Dragon Communion Seal+5 about 650 damage
Godslayer's Seal+12 approx. 550 damage
Fai 28
Arc 50
It seems that the gain of this seal is better for blood samurai.
Even though different seals and glinstone staves have buffs for Incantations and Sorceries, I think it's best to match your own numerical curve gain to the seals and glinstone staves, right?

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Can confirm that as of 1.03.2 Arcane scaling still does not work for Weapon buffs (e.g. Bloodflame Blade, Electrify Armament). Arcane scaling DOES however work for direct damage spells (e.g. Fireball, Lightning Bolt).

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Did a bit of testing on my own because I wanted to figure out how to do as much damage with frenzy spells as possible (for those wondering, this seal won by a mile v.s. the frenzied flame seal). Seems like the soft caps for stats on this (and possibly all hybrid catalysts, I didn't test that far) are 30 and 45. Even after 45 though, putting points into Arcane gave back about a 1 to 1 increase in Incant scaling, roughly equivalent to how much Incant scaling Faith gives between 30 and 45. Absurdly good if you intend to do a lot of damage via incantations, obviously not important if you are just looking for a seal to cast buffs.

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I've seen a few comments throwing around slightly incorrect stuff. Dragon Communion Seal's weapon buffs scales from your + AR from it.

At 61 + 123, my Ripple Blade received 57 fire damage from Bloodflame Blade, despite my Incantation Scaling of 318. 57/123 = roughly 0.45, which is the multiplier for Bloodflame Blade's modifier.

I'm uncertain to whether this is purely for Bloodflame Blade, but I've been getting other confusing results. For instance, when my Arcane decreases by 8, my Incantation Scaling goes up but the Seal's scaling goes down. I think this is just horribly bugged.

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Is this the best seal for Swarm of Flies incantation on a purely Arcane build? I am mid-game.

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You can stop at 45 arcane. Like split casting tools in the past, it's best to split the stats between fth and arc. As higher faith will let you hit the spell casting requirements. 47/45 you can stop and it wont feel like your wasting stats.

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Man now It makes sense that I found myself not having a way to do good melee damage with my dragon knight (full faith/arc). I was wondering why weapon buffs were so bad at 50fth/50arc. Hope this will be patched soon.

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At +10 with 45 faith and 45 arcane the incantation scaling is 336.

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Will holding 2 stack the boost?

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As of 1.03.1 the Weapon Buff Incants cast with this Seal are still bugged, and only scale off of the Faith scaling, not the Arcane. Hopefully this is fixed soon, would like to see how well Bloodflame Blade scales with this on an Arcane build.

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I have 80 Arcane, 45 Faith, after testing my incantation enchants like electrify, volk's dragonbolt, bloodflame, it seems that no matter how much you incantation scaling on your dragon communion seal is, the spells scale off only faith, not arcane.

At 46 faith, I have 237 scaling on my gravel stone, 230 on Erdtree, and 373 on my dragon communion. Both Erdtree and Gravel stone give me a bigger buff then dragon communion because they have S faith scaling.

TLDR - Incantations scale off faith, not seals

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"Will increase the build up of status effect that spells cause, like madness for Frenzied Burst"

Does anyone have evidence of this or know why this would be the case? Seems kind of random for this seal specifically.

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29 FAI, 55 ARC, +10 (Somber) Dragon Seal, 325 Incant Power: Bloodflame Blade Buff = +58 damage. Lightning Armament Buff = 110 damage.
Now, same stats but +12 (Regular) Finger Seal, 155 Incant Power: Bloodflame Blade Buff = +62 damage. Lightning Armament Buff = 116 damage.

I cannot see how this can be intended. Buffs should scale from raw incantation power given by a chosen seal, not just one stat. As it stands right now I literally have to carry a 2nd seal around just for buffing, which isn't a super big deal but it doesn't feel good. If this is intended, at least Bloodflame Blade buff should scale with Arcane.

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Will this seal scale the fire damage on bladeflame blade in a Arc build?

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