Thiollier's Hidden Needle | Elden Ring Wiki

HealerUwU and Mani are the same person until proven otherwise. They both only post garbage ragebait comments, and no life on the forums.

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"why is this weapon so short" it's called a "hidden needle," I don't really expect the weapon to be visible unless I had to squint really hard to see the needles coming out of the wrists.

also y'all do not want a thrusting fist weapon with actual range, because that's how we ended up with the Pata and to a lesser extent, the Katar

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This weapon is a euphemism for INT users' junk

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Useless weapon for useless people

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Make it much bigger, flip it upside down and you have a sleep staff instead of this crappy fist weapon. If only

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Valorant players **** size confirmed

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The best builds for sleep will almost always be a dexterity build for damage scaling, and arcane for status scaling, unfortunately unless you are using specific arcane weapons using sleep grease, dex will always be to the go-to, with weapons requiring anywhere between 14-16 int. The torch is unfortunately never going to be competitive with the other options.

Personally it feels like they should have leaned entirely into the dex/int or dex/arc option rather than splitting it between fth/int/arc for the mental stats, at least for the unique weapons (it is clear they had their hearts set on making it mostly a dex set up for the weapons)

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Man, I want to try a int / arcane build using sleep as main element, but with scalings like that it's going to be a nightmare. If my build works smoothly, is there a place where I can share it?

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The way Sleep is available to all builds, incentivizing builds variety:
– Hidden Needle's damage scales mostly with Dex;
– the old sword scales best with Str/Dex;
– the new one prefers investment in Int;
– torch scales with Fai and pots with Arc;
– Minimum Int required – 14, max – 16;
– 8 of 10 starting classes can reach 14 Int through a single +5 Int talisman.

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If they would just increase the window to be able to use the ash of war it'd be a decent weapon

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Ironically pretty decent against divine beat warrior. Hard to break stance? Infinite poise? Eternal sleep solves that. Helped farm the DB armor

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- Sleep scales with arc
- Poison user in dlc
- Poison scales with arc
- Sells an arc weapon
- Armour boosts arc
- Npc is sleep related
- Sleep weapon used by dex/arc build scales with int
Why Micheal Zaki

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Sleep needle and swords scale with int
Sleep torch scales with faith
Sleep pots scale with arc
Consistency, FromSoft. Please.

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Fromsoft really took some dude's ketamine needle and put it in the game

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This would be great if the window to get the sleep detonation off was a bit longer. Right now it’s so tight it feels like a bug and doesn’t work most of the time

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Can’t believe that out of all the dlc weapons, the ring finger sleep needle is my favourite. Override skill goes well in the off hand with velvet sword of Trina as a main, and detonating sleep was the exact mechanic sleep builds needed. Aside from that this actually does really good damage on a dex build regardless. Don’t sleep on sleep builds, the dlc made it more than viable.

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When the PVE players cry because the weapon you get after killing PCR is PvP focused

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I call the left one honk and the right one shoo

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If only this had slightly more range....

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This needs a slight buff to the sleep build up.

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Everyone crying about the idea of it being an int weapon. It's not. Look at the damage, biased to physical. Look at the scaling, biased towards dexterity. It's a dex weapon with an int requirement. Chill out. And as far as the lack of arcane scaling goes, it doesn't make sense why arcane even boosts sleep buildup.

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I don't think increasing the stagger window will help anyone. This weapon is hindered by crappy design choices on From's part, namely insisting that sleep weapons scale with int rather than arc, not adding any quick or varied sleep options aside from a fancy pot and a reskined st.Trina's sword. I was shocked to learn there are no sleep incantations or sorceries. With no cheap, quick ways to inflict sleep that force you to farm for items or dual wield St. Trina's sword with the new one, sleep is only ever going to be viable on the ripple halberd (and that's assuming you're willing to farm for the grease).

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Useless weapon for a useless NPC

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Some of the comments are getting downvoted for speaking facts. The boosted weapon art is almost impossible to land when sleep only staggers the enemy. This will be perfect if they buff the window on the aow.

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some people are complaing that sleep is weak... no, sleep is already very strong in all its forms, mainly by having a lot of item discovery and arcane and farming the required materials. in pvp it's the most powerful status effect because it can stun people even through their rolls (but not if they jump) only madness can really come close. using the shotgun crossbow with sleep bolts and having this needle in the offhand is a disusting combo in pvp.

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If asleep, AoW true combos into another R2

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missed out on this because i didn't look up that i needed to kms 4 times to progress his quest

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No wonder he's so weak. Why are you using an INT weapon on your ARC build 4head

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the weapon art straight up doesn't work 90% of the time... it's especially bleak against enemies that only stagger when slept instead of going all the way out. they really need to increase the window you can use it on sleeping enemies, it's such a cool concept but it's so finicky

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The fact that the timing on the skill for staggered enemies is so incredibly tight almost feels like a bug. You can pretty much only get it off if they're still attacking both when you inflict them with sleep AND when you hit them with the skill, which is both incredibly luck dependent, hard to time, and probably won't work anyways if you don't have a lot of poise, because you'll just get staggered out by the enemy's attack.

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SECRET TECH: This weapon unlike the other fist weapons let's you use it's ash of war even when equipped in left hand. This is very useful.

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You don't have to summon him for the final fight. I had attempted it a number of times with him and ansbach, but ultimately succeeded in a run without summoning either.

Both Thiollier and Ansbach were waiting for me in the boss arena (both dead) after I sat down at the site of grace and dropped all their stuff.

So, based on my experience, maybe at least summon them once and die (just in case!) and then do whatever you want.

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The skill on hit seems to inflict about 55 [eternal] sleep by itself, which makes 97 buildup including the base weapon sleep buildup. Haven't tested for Int scaling though.

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I need to see this powerstanced with the Madding Hand. You think phantom hits that build up Madness is bad? Wait 'til you have to start worrying about Sleep buildup AND Madness buildup coming from the same player!

(I mean, it'll probably be really awful, since you're splitting the buildup between two different hitboxes and two different statuses that might not even connect and build up evenly. Still, though... It'd make for a fun meme.)

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So if I only want to use it for the AOW should I pick dex or an int build also if it only scale with the wepon level I might still be able to use it with the ripple blade

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Nah from is just trolling sleep builds to get a wepon that is a core for pve sleep builds as it gives that burst of damage like the posion kick you need to beat the final boss of the dlc and summon an npc that will make the boss harder screw that at least let us kill thollier at the start of the dlc to get this fist other wise I am using a mod to get this early

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This weapon needs buffed someone make a petition

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Please if anybody out there loves this weapon like I do please make a petition to have this weapon buffed we need more sleep proc

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AoW works as an off-handed weapon.

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Fun Fact:
While Two-Handing/Dual Wielding this, the weapon on the right hand is on the middle finger, while the one on the left hand is placed on the ring finger.

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can anyone with spare larval tears test if the Skill deals more damage with int or dex?
Feels kinda **** in pvp for the setup it requires,it's usually worth more to just heavy or light attack

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Anyone else thought your character was gonna hold it like the Katar only to find out it's literally a needle on a ring

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What's the more disappointing St Trina related weapon folks?

This or the clone of St Trina's sword?

Or the non existent St Trina's Bow?

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Please correct the FTH scaling to INT.

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If wielded in the left hand, when pressing L2 this thing gets to use its AoW rather than triggering the right-hand weapon skill like most offhand weapons. Make of this what you will.

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The special effect of the weapon skill is terrible. It only deals extra damage to enemies that are completely knocked out by sleep and doesn’t proc for the light stagger

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the scaling is wrong. its 15 INT D rating. NOT 15 FTH D rating.

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Does it do extra damage to enemies that are just in the stagger animation triggered by sleep build-up or do they actually have to be passed the eff out on the ground?

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This thing at +0 can one shot the enemies on Palace Approach Ledge-Road, use R2 on sleeping enemies and It will one-shot

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What in the world is eternal sleep? So far all I'm noticing is the purple above people's heads is more violet

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If you win in the Thiollier's invading battle and forget to talk to her after and kill the endboss without progressing her storyline you wont get this weapon nor the armor.
TLDR; if you kill the endboss without Thiollier's storyline you cant get the weapon until ng+.

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The requirement is 15 int, not 15 faith. Scaling is the same at a D.

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faith???? all the other sleep weapons scale with int

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Can anyone tell me the +10 scalings of this weapon?

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Gom Jabbar

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Sleep pata

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